As usual the focus has been hijacked. This is first and foremost a men's (and boy's) issue:

www.ted.com/talks/jackson_katz_violence_...n_it_s_a_men_s_issue

I am appalled that anyone would use this tragic event as a call to action for increased access to toilets. This is a call to action for men and boys to stop raping. This is a call to action for the world's societies to dramatically change how boys are raised and taught and rethink the lessons and role models to be supported and promoted. We need to radically alter our perceptions regarding what's acceptable for men's behavior, for advertising, for religion, for culture, etc. This is so much bigger than a toilet issue.


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Added by moderator (EvM)

About the TED talk:

Violence against women — it's a men's issue

Domestic violence and sexual abuse are often called "women’s issues.” But in this bold, blunt talk, Jackson Katz points out that these are intrinsically men’s issues — and shows how these violent behaviors are tied to definitions of manhood. A clarion call for us all — women and men — to call out unacceptable behavior and be leaders of change.

The IRC blog is excellent. It does a great job of explaining how toilets are not an immediate 'fix' to the problem, nor are they the root cause. Bravo guys.

I especially like the part about how forcing women to stay in the home to avoid rape impinges on their freedoms.

Dear Elisabeth, dear all,

under the shock of reading about this terrible crime, I actually tried to get more support to the Mosan
(forum.susana.org/forum/categories/52-mob...sh?limit=10&start=10)
that we had developed in Bangladesh as an indoor solution for households that lack a toilet. I was not even aware of the campaigns that linked to this incident - or "used" it...

For my understanding, the causality of having a toilet and having no further risks of sexual harassment is not a discussion about yes or no, black or white . Certainly having a toilet at home does not ensure full security. And neither does your lamp on the bicycle or the traffic light on the street. HOWEVER as a father, I am happy that I can decrease the probability of an accident by making my children USE the lamp at night and cross the street where the traffic light is. I would be very upset, if the municipality would remove the traffic lights in our street! And if an accident would happen afterwards, I would rightly blame them. Of course it was the car involved and the drunken driver who caused it and the general lack of following traffic rules by speeding in the neighborhood. But it was ALSO the lack of the traffic light! Apologies for this more than simple metaphor, but as a father of girls in India - and elsewhere (!), I would be more than happy if I can avoid that they have to walk out in the dark ... a toilet would help. MoSan would help immediately. Discussing about it and not acting does not help...

It'd be great if that blog post was written up as an article for the Guardian (or other media outlet).

Thanks Giacomo, that's an excellent blog post by you and your IRC colleagues Deirdre C. Casella and Alana Potter (entitled: Inequity - a shared root cause of low access to sanitation services and violence against women)! It sheds light on this complex issue of violence against women!

Please make sure you also bring it to the attention to people on Twitter - there are lots of tweets out there today by WaterAid, WSUP, Sanergy, and many well-meaning individuals which have the simplistic tenor of "these two girls in India were killed because they had no toilets". I know they are writing tweets like this for a good cause - i.e. to increase attention to the sanitation crisis - but in this case it's just not so helpful (and might actually back-fire on us), for the reasons outlined so well in IRC's blog post.
Thanks.

Regards,
Elisabeth

Dear all,

Amongst some of my colleagues there was also some discomfort in the "1:1 connection" as Elisabeth puts it. We have written a blogpost that bundles some of our thoughts. Feel free to comment here or on the website.

www.ircwash.org/blog/inequity-root-cause...olence-against-women

regards,
Giacomo

Unfortunately this meme is spreading:

www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-06-02/toilet...women-easy-prey.html

(Note this is Page 2 of the discussion; click on Page 1 above to access the earlier posts)

Hi Dani,

I'm not sure it does make sense. First you are right to say that some Australians (and probably a whole lot of other people) might try blaming the people or the culture for allowing their girls outside at night. But instead they're now blaming people or cultures for failing to have toilets. I'm not sure there is much of a difference there.

Second, thousands of sexual crimes are happening all the time - and there are many places around the world where there is a danger to women of using toilets. The problem with the current discussion is that there is a coincidental timing of the UN 'open defecation' campaign and these horrendous stories in the media - and that now people who should know better are using it as an opportunity to highlight the issue of open defecation by saying things like 'look - the link between open defecation and rape'.

Of course, we all know that these things are more complicated than a soundbite, but the impression given to the public (and, I'd suggest, intended to be given to the public) is that open defecation causes sexual violence and that stopping open defecation is necessary for the safety of women.

The reality is that it is not possible to say whether women would be safer unless we agree what it is that we want to replace the open defecation with given there are many communities around the world which have toilets/latrines and high rates of rape associated with them. Similarly I don't believe it is possible to call any sanitation intervention safe (to women, microbiologically or in any other way) unless we have standards as to what would be considered to be safe. A latrine emptied into a river might not be open defecation but is obviously not desirable or much of an improvement. An indoor latrine might reduce the number of rapes but still be very unsafe and be a known place of sexual violence to women.

I just think talking about the issues in this way is very unhelpful.

YES!


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I find it really interesting how this story is being perceived in different areas of the world.

As a development practitioner I can see that there are a myriad of factors at play here, not least of which include corruption, caste inequities, mysogyny...

Personally, I have felt it necessary in Australia to alert people to the fact that the girls were out after dark because they had no toilet at home- because I feel there is a lot of innate racism here. It is very, very sad, but it is also true (my country often disgusts me in such matters). I have not heard this stated directly, but from past experience I fear this is how many Australians see this situation:

"Serves them/their family right for going out/letting them out after dark. Naughty children/bad parenting. Clearly there is something wrong with their culture."

Now, I clearly don't think that the only reason the girls were raped and murdered was because they were out, and ending OD will do nothing to improve the ongoing violence and corruption issues, but the fact is that those girls had no choice but to be out after dark (for their own dignity if nothing else).

Does that make sense?

Dear Colleagues,

Please do not mixed up crude crime and proper sanitation, regardless warm or cold countries.

Thanks,
Detlef

muench wrote:

While public sanitation is a major issue in India — a defining issue in the recent election, even — it’s hardly the point of this story. In the wake of this tragedy, we can build all the “safe toilets” we want. But let’s not live under the illusion that sexual violence will end because of it.

Once again, we need a multi-pronged approach here to reduce sexual violence in India (and all over the world, in fact). Toilets have a small part to play but my suspicion is that the toilet's contribution will be insignificant if not all the other factors are tackled as well!

Regards,
Elisabeth

Thank you Elisabeth, that is a very important point which is being repeatedly missed by those who are loudly advocating the Open Defecation campaign and linking it to these tragic stories in the media to suit their purposes.

I'm sorry, I simply do not believe there are statistics that prove that murderous rapists are going to be put off by users having forms of 'improved' sanitation interventions rather than open defecation. I agree that open defecation makes people very vulnerable, but as the high rate of sexual violence in places like South Africa shows, having a toilet is not a protection against rape and murder.