Hi Elisabeth,

The idea of working on the Wikipedia articles in Portuguese came as part of the National Programme on Rural Sanitation, that is being coordinated by my university (UFMG), and contracted by the National Health Foundation, an organ of the Ministry of Health in Brazil. The final report should include a description of the technological solutions, in such a way that it could be understandable by non-technical people, especially those living in rural areas. This is why I remembered our good experience on the Wikipedia articles (I worked on the Stabilization Ponds with you), proposed that the description of the technologies should be in this platform to allow a broader dissemination, and the idea was very well received and is to be implemented.

In the Brazilian reality, most of the people we are trying to reach do not read English. This is why we think it is important to produce the Wikipedia articles in Portuguese.

Best regards,

Marcos

Thanks, Marcos, that's good.

Do tell me more about this:

we will check/update/revise/create articles related to technological solutions for water supply, sanitation, solid waste management and storm water management in rural areas

Is this a funded activity or voluntary?

Is the Portuguese Wikipedia popular in Brazil? (personally, I hardly ever use the German one (my mother tongue) as I find it less detailed than the English one, apart from topics that are specifically German)

Regards,
Elisabeth

Hi Elisabeth,

Regarding the question of sludge management in ponds, in my last revision I had clarified the issue of removing frequency for the three different types of ponds (anaerobic, facultative, maturation).

Now I added a paragraph (last one in the section Operation and Maintenance) describing the different desludging techniques. I edited directly in Wikipedia - please see if its ok. Sorry for using again the reference of my open access book. Other references could have been used, but we have a chapter on this topic in the book, and it is an open access source.

Now on a different front: regarding your earlier suggestion of developing Wikipedia articles in Portuguese, we will check/update/revise/create articles related to technological solutions for water supply, sanitation, solid waste management and storm water management in rural areas, as part of the Brazilian Program on Rural Sanitation. Hope they will be useful.

Cheers,

Marcos

Dear Marcos (and anyone else interested in waste stabilization ponds),

I’ve made all the changes from your Word document to the Wikipedia article now.
I’ve added a new section on Operation and Maintenance because I think that's important. I have also mentioned something about sludge removal for each type of pond now. Isn't it a bit contradictory though if we say the anaerobic ponds need their sludge removed every few years, but elsewhere we say there is hardly any maintenance required and sludge only has to be removed once every ten years or so?
My impression in developing countries is that sludge removal usually gets completely ignored - which is not good!

I’ve mentioned in the first sentences that “lagoon” is used as an alternative term (I think particularly in the U.S., right?).

I have added the schematic that you had sent but I couldn’t add the image that is based on Google Earth. I checked their licence and it does not allow commercial uses, so it’s NOT open access (open access would be for ALL uses, even commercial). Open street maps is under an open license but I think they don’t have satellite images, right?

By the way, the references that we cite in the document don’t have to be open access; it’s handy for the reader though if they are (or if at least the pdf files are freely available; there is a difference between freely available pdf files and open access). So just in case in future you want to cite other documents that are not open access, you can do so.

If you spot any small typos or similar from here on, you could edit them directly in Wikipedia itself (I see you have now done so already - great!).

Thanks for this very fruitful cooperation! Further readers of Wikipedia will be thankful. (currently the page gets about 100 views per day)

Regards,
Elisabeth

Hi again, Elisabeth,

Thank you again for your additional editing, and everything looks great to me. I only did minor edits myself, directly in the Wikipedia article. Changed a verb in the section on anaerobic ponds, and clarified a bit more the section on operation, as you had suggested.

Hope we are very close to a satisfactory version.

Best regards,

Marcos

Hi Elisabeth,

Thanks for this next step on our chapter. Regarding your questions:

1 - New text and references. I wrote the text on a free way, in order to make it more compatible with Wikipedia style. But for the sake of completeness, I have now added a few additional references (marked in yellow in this new file (version 2). I would like to quote other classical references, but they are not available as open access. Therefore I resorted to only a few additional ones, including other volumes of our IWA series.

2 - New figures. I will send jpg files, as requested. The drawings of the ponds schemes have been done by me, adapting drawings available at our open access IWA books. Since they have been somewhat adapted, I think that the copyright belongs to me, and I am happy to release them as open access files. The other picture, of a system of facultative ponds followed by maturations ponds, is from a Google Earth image, which I edited to include names of the ponds. Do you know whether this type of image is also open access (I hope so, because they have been obtained by a traditional open access programme, I guess - but I think you have more experience than I)?

Best wishes,

Marcos

Dear Marcos,

Thanks for your second round of edits to the Wikipedia article on "Waste stabilization ponds" which you had attached to your post above as a Word document. I have started entering your changes into the Wikipedia article; I will do a few edits each day and hopefully be done within early next week.

A couple of questions to you:
1. Is the new text in red new text or text that was moved from a different part of the article? If new text then what reference(s) could we use for the different paragraphs or main sentences? I know it can be hard when it’s textbook knowledge to keep citing the same thing; but we do need to provide more citations for these new blocks of text.
2. Could you send me the images as high resolution jpg files by e-mail, and are you the copyright owner of them and are you happy to release them under an open access licence? This is a requirement for adding them to Wikipedia articles.

I like the new text block that you have inserted to explain the term "stabilization" to lay persons. I've given this its own sub-heading now, see here:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waste_stabilizatio...ept_of_stabilization
(it does still need a reference or two though)

If at any point in future you want to edit this or other Wikipedia articles directly (rather than via the Word document tracked changes route), then just ask me. Or take up a Wikipedia login and click on the "edit" button at the top of any article. It's easy. But I am also happy if you prefer to go via the Word document route - no problem either way.

Regards,
Elisabeth

We should be thanking you, Marcos ! It was great to have your expertise. I didn't know much about waste stabilization and I learned a great deal. You included just enough detail, without overwhelming the average reader.

The process we used did seem to work well. The expert can stay focused on the content of the article, without having to worry about learning the ins and outs of Wikipedia.

With appreciation,
Diane

Hi again,
I think the Word file has not been attached (see my previous post, minutes ago). Here we go again.
Cheers,
Marcos

Dear Elisabeth and Diane,

Thank you very much for your careful reading, analysis and excellent editing of the first draft of our Wikipedia article on waste stabilization ponds. I agree with your points and suggestions. In my second reading, after your edits, I inserted some new sentences and modified others, in order to clarify some points you had raised. Please feel free to modify them.

Please find attached the Word file with track changes. I used the same system as before, because I don´t know how to edit directly on Wikipedia.

I am also attaching the jpg file of the ponds configurations. We can call it like that, instead of flowsheet.

Best regards,

Marcos

Dear Marcos,

Thanks a lot for sending your edits and additions to the Wikipedia article on "Waste stabilization ponds" in a marked up Word document.
Good news: your edits have now been incorporated into the Wikipedia article by Diane and myself.
The new version looks like this:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waste_stabilization_pond

Some few points:
1. I moved some content that seemed to me like excessive detail (and which was not written by you), to the sub-articles on anaerobic ponds and facultative ponds (those in turn would eventually also need improvement but that can come at some later date).
2. Could we explain what the word “stabilization” stands for. We wrote somewhere “is stabilized” but what does that really mean? Can we give an easy explanation for the layperson for that?
3. I wonder if we don’t downplay that issue with removing the sludge too much. There are so many ponds out there which are in dire need of desludging… I have added one such photo from Zimbabwe.
4. I have added a few photos that I have available; if you have other favorite photos that you’d like to see used, just send them to me.
5. I could add that schematic that you sent but could you please send it as a jpg file? If it’s open access from your book then I don’t think we need to ask IWA Publishing.

Diane also pointed out that average readers don't always need to see scientific terms, but in some cases it's good to offer them that along with the explanation. Also, active voice Is preferable to passive voice.

I hope you like how it now looks. We have tried to make the language simple enough for lay persons. If we lost accuracy somewhere please let us know.
In case you are curious to see the edits we made to the article, you can see them all in the revision history here:
en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Waste..._pond&action=history

Thanks so much again for your expert inputs and edits! (if you feel like making further small edits directly in the Wikipedia article then don’t hold back )

Cheers,
Elisabeth
& Diane

P.S. This method of going via a marked-up Word document could be a model of the future so that experts don't have to waste time learning how to edit Wikipedia and how to add references but can focus on providing new content and deleting or changing inaccurate old content.

Dear Elisabeth,

Sorry for the long time taken to make the revision of the Wikipedia text on Waste Stabilization Ponds. As I had told you before, I could work on it only during my holidays, because of the excess of commitments and trips during the academic semester.

I did not know how to edit the text directly in Wikipedia. Tried to understand it, saw that I would need to have a login name, but was afraid to spoil the current text on it. Since I am not much familiar with these aspects, I decided to edit it as a separate Word file (attached), inserting comments and using track changes. I worked intensively on it, and felt that many changes were necessary, while still trying to keep the text a simple one. Well, here it goes. I hope it will not be difficult for you to put the text back on the Wikipedia page. Please note that the hyperlinks to specific words and references may have been lost.

I am also sending you a CorelDraw figure that maybe you can incorporate to the text (figure saved as pdf and jpg, since the posting system does not accept cdr extensions - if necessary, I can send you the cdr file outside the system).

Please get back to me if you have any questions.

All the best in 2018!

Marcos