Theme 2: Financing capital and running costs

  • paresh
  • paresh's Avatar
  • Posts: 8
  • Likes received: 4

Re: Theme 2: Financing capital and running costs

Dear Prof. Gunilla,
The report prepared by high powered expert committee (HPEC) to calculate investment needed for urban infrastructure makes assumptions of per capita cost for sewerage based on city size for construction and O&M, if it helps.
The following user(s) like this post: nityajacob, AjitSeshadri, observatory
You need to login to reply
  • raogk
  • raogk's Avatar
  • Posts: 2
  • Likes received: 2

Re: Reply: Theme 2: Financing capital and running costs

Dear Nitya

Well well discussed. In fact we need to know the actual effluent discharge parameters of existing dewats plants and fstps to know their efficiency and ways and means of enhancing them. Although discharging septic tank effluent to storm water drains is not a satisfactory or permanent solution, leading it to soak pit as per standards needs frequent emptying and odour nuisance and unhygienic Environment nearby specially in monsoon.

A later addition of simplified sewerage system or small bore sewerage system when funds are made available will be more appropriate to make it Environment friendly and safe.

Warm regards G. Kondala Rao Freelance engineer.
The following user(s) like this post: nityajacob
You need to login to reply
  • Gunilla
  • Gunilla's Avatar
  • Posts: 8
  • Karma: 1
  • Likes received: 7

Re: Theme 2: Financing capital and running costs

Dear Paresh,

Thanks for the suggestion. This sounds very much like the kind of data I am looking for - where do I find that report (please excuse my ignorance)

best, Gunilla

My research deals with the production and use of science for policy focusing on sustainable sewage management in growing urban areas and scientific controversies tied to risk assessment of endocrine disrupting substances. The questions that drive my research are: What kind of knowledge is needed, used and trusted? How does the knowledge used impact perceived solutions? How might we facilitate for decision makers and the public to ‘unpack’ assumptions, values and preferences that are embedded in such knowledge?

I also conduct research in higher education, with the questions above in the...
You need to login to reply
  • Gunilla
  • Gunilla's Avatar
  • Posts: 8
  • Karma: 1
  • Likes received: 7

Re: Theme 2: Financing capital and running costs

Hi again Paresh,

Please ignore my previous message: I didn't realize how easy it was to find the report you mention. I simply googled "report prepared by high powered expert committee (HPEC) to calculate investment needed for urban infrastructure" and found a pdf of .... "The High Powered Expert Committee (HPEC) for Estimating the Investment Requirements for Urban Infrastructure Services" :)



thanks again,
Gunilla

My research deals with the production and use of science for policy focusing on sustainable sewage management in growing urban areas and scientific controversies tied to risk assessment of endocrine disrupting substances. The questions that drive my research are: What kind of knowledge is needed, used and trusted? How does the knowledge used impact perceived solutions? How might we facilitate for decision makers and the public to ‘unpack’ assumptions, values and preferences that are embedded in such knowledge?

I also conduct research in higher education, with the questions above in the...
The following user(s) like this post: AjitSeshadri
You need to login to reply
  • MODIneha
  • MODIneha's Avatar
  • Posts: 2
  • Likes received: 1

Re: Theme 2: Financing capital and running costs

Hi, I am Neha working with Urban Management Center in Ahmedabad. We are providing support to central and state government on WASH sectors. What you mentioned about the polluters pay principle where the city is not paying the users for the cost of entire system i feel is incorrect. The tax payers in India is very less in numbers. The city ULB's provides the systems to the users are minimum cost, which they hardly have to pay for the connection turning out to 1000-2000 Rs maximum which is one time. Rest they pay as house tax "VERA bill" as we call in Gujarat.

The major issue and the challenge in the ULB are the floating population, migrants which gets difficult to connect to these networks might end up practising Open Defecation in many cases. The polluters pay connects needs to be adapted which is not in India to sensitive and educate the citizens. The running cost could be sustained easily to a certain level only if these are paid regularly.
The following user(s) like this post: AjitSeshadri
You need to login to reply
  • sharadaprasad
  • sharadaprasad's Avatar
    Topic Author
  • Sharada Prasad CS
  • Posts: 34
  • Karma: 2
  • Likes received: 18

Re: Theme 2: Financing capital and running costs

Dear Prof.Oberg,

I attaching a recently collected data on the STP construction cost and sewer (UGD) cost from Hubli and Dharwad.

All costs in INR (Cr is Crore = 10 million)

I am not sure of the exact length of the sewer lines installed (should not be too hard to find out). Hope that helps
This attachment is hidden for guests.
Please log in or register to see it.

Best,
CS Sharada Prasad (CSP), PhD
Academic, Sanitation expert, WaSH consultant, and Photographer
sharadaprasad.com

This message has an attachment file.
Please log in or register to see it.

The following user(s) like this post: AjitSeshadri
You need to login to reply
  • sharadaprasad
  • sharadaprasad's Avatar
    Topic Author
  • Sharada Prasad CS
  • Posts: 34
  • Karma: 2
  • Likes received: 18

Re: Theme 2: Financing capital and running costs

Dear Neha,

Thank you for your comment. I am not getting the point of your argument. I am a bit confused.

Most of the cities are not providing any support for treating fecal sludge. Yes, there is a lot of work going on in terms of building FSTPs in several cities. We have handful of operational FSTPs too in this country. But the point regarding connection charges that you are making is probably related to sewer systems alone. Am I right?

I agree with you regarding the floating population. The problem also lies in the way city enforces the conditions under which such a population lives. Most of the people who migrate to Bangalore to do construction labor live in labor camps / temporary sheds where there are no toilets. If the builder is not required by law to provide sanitation facility, the only option is open defecation. I have spoken to labourers who build fancy apartment complexes, and work in government infrastructure projects. Toilets are nowhere to be seen in several of those projects.

Four years ago I was visiting IIT Delhi campus for a workshop. Its swimming pool was getting renovated. There was a labour camp right next to the swimming complex. Workers had to defecate in open, inside IIT Delhi campus, even though there are toilets in every building. The security guards did not allow these workers (some of them were women) to use the toilets. Our prime minister is busy building toilets while there are certain social structures that stop people from certain classes to access existing toilets.

Best,
CS Sharada Prasad (CSP), PhD
Academic, Sanitation expert, WaSH consultant, and Photographer
sharadaprasad.com
The following user(s) like this post: muench, nityajacob, AjitSeshadri
You need to login to reply
  • MODIneha
  • MODIneha's Avatar
  • Posts: 2
  • Likes received: 1

Re: Theme 2: Financing capital and running costs

Yes, I meant it that way on the connection charges, in many cities the problem is of getting the slums or poor sections or even to the socities due to social stigma to get connected to the system even if they are given IIHL under various mission run by government.

The point you are taking of is really an issue in India. The sensitivity and awareness of the issue is lacking. Irony here, We hand we have , movie made in India getting Oscars nomination whereas on other than the same village where its shot doesn't have toilet facility which we are failing to provide even with such mega mission running in the country.
You need to login to reply
  • AjitSeshadri
  • AjitSeshadri's Avatar
  • Posts: 58
  • Likes received: 10

Re: Theme 2: Financing capital and running costs

Dear Sharada Prasad,

I have found the inference, given by you on notings by Ms. Neha very informative and needs to be assessed.

For assessment if we take the 1st note :
Most of the cities are not providing any support for treating fecal sludge.
Yes, there is a lot of work going on in terms of building FSTPs in several cities. We have handful of operational FSTPs too in this country.
But the point regarding connection charges that you are making is probably related to sewer systems alone.

The below mentioned, may be assessed :
The main issue is that there is no responsibility of the safe disposal of sewage, waste-waters and solid waste Etc. in urban areas.
ULBs as per their convenience apply their practices and do what they feel best at most regions.
There are no clear rules and regulations that are followed and their deliveries are apt and maintained.
If an ULB is doing their job right, then the Municipal Administration feel that a note-worthy efforts are being done.
They are also praised for the job, they ought to be doing in normal mode .

In all functional FSTPs, a method is needed to be evolved in principle - for recovery of sludges generated and re-used.
All these sludges could be co-composted with urban bio-mass, dairy waste and others. Only when this compost is used in urban-scapes or rural areas, the communities stand to benefit. Also the recycled water is ensured conforming to standards and used for irrigating farms Etc.

For assessment if we take the 2nd note :
I have spoken to labourers who build fancy apartment complexes, and work in government infrastructure projects.
Toilets are nowhere to be seen in several of those projects.

The below mentioned, may be assessed :
Here too, we need to have some form of Controlled Open Defecation, COD ie have recovery of sludges generated and re-used.
Again, all these sludges could be co-composted with urban bio-mass and others. This compost is used in urban-scapes . The respective areas are cleaned and maintained clean.

For making rural and urban areas ODF, this method of COD could be adopted, till the toilets are planned and done with adequate infras, at allocated regions.

well wishes,
Prof. Ajit Seshadri , Vels University, Chennai, India.
You need to login to reply
  • nityajacob
  • nityajacob's Avatar
  • Water Policy Analyst and Author; Moderator of the ISC-SuSanA India Chapter
  • Posts: 175
  • Karma: 6
  • Likes received: 78

Re: Theme 2: Financing capital and running costs

Dear all,

Thank you for a lively and interesting discussion on financing capital and running costs. While we work on the synthesis document you are welcome to provide more inputs over the next 3-4 days.

Regards,
Nitya Jacob
The following user(s) like this post: AjitSeshadri
You need to login to reply
  • nityajacob
  • nityajacob's Avatar
  • Water Policy Analyst and Author; Moderator of the ISC-SuSanA India Chapter
  • Posts: 175
  • Karma: 6
  • Likes received: 78

Re: Theme 2: Financing capital and running costs

Dear Prof Oberg
I found a link that may help your case - gmdwsb.assam.gov.in/portlets/jica-assist...ati-sewerage-project . Its about a sewerage project in Guwahati, Assam.

Location of the Project (Zone-I) Guwahati Kamrup Metropolitan District
(South Central and South East Area) Assam
Target Population (i) 2020 : 10.10 lakhs
(ii)2035: 14.95 lakhs
(iii)2050: 23.32 lakhs
Project Implementation Period 7 (seven) Years
Construction of Capacity Treatment Plant
on ASP technology 187 MLD
Trunk Sewers 201 Km
Lateral Sewers 501 Km
Laying of Pumping Main Station 16.915 Km
Gravity Main 184.198 Km
Number of Pumping Stations 5 (five) Nos.
Number of Lifting Stations 18 (eighteen) Nos.
Number of House Connections,
Power Connections and Road Restoration 101058 Nos.
Trenchless Pipe Laying 880 metres
Total Project Cost JICA Portion: INR 1001.28 crore
State Share: INR 177.47 crore
Total: INR 1178.75 crore
(1 crore = 10 million, the current rupee exchange rate is about 70 to a US dollar)
Regards
Nitya
The following user(s) like this post: AjitSeshadri
You need to login to reply
  • Gunilla
  • Gunilla's Avatar
  • Posts: 8
  • Karma: 1
  • Likes received: 7

Re: Theme 2: Financing capital and running costs

Dear Nitya,
Thank you, this looks like it might be the kind of data we need for our analysis. I'm very grateful for all of your efforts. May I get back to you if I run into difficulties in interpreting the information?

best,
Gunilla

My research deals with the production and use of science for policy focusing on sustainable sewage management in growing urban areas and scientific controversies tied to risk assessment of endocrine disrupting substances. The questions that drive my research are: What kind of knowledge is needed, used and trusted? How does the knowledge used impact perceived solutions? How might we facilitate for decision makers and the public to ‘unpack’ assumptions, values and preferences that are embedded in such knowledge?

I also conduct research in higher education, with the questions above in the...
The following user(s) like this post: nityajacob, AjitSeshadri
You need to login to reply
Share this thread:
Recently active users. Who else has been active?
Time to create page: 0.648 seconds