SuSanA - Forum Kunena Site Syndication http://forum.susana.org/ Fri, 28 Nov 2014 00:08:58 +0000 Kunena 1.6 http://forum.susana.org/components/com_kunena/template/default/images/icons/rss.png SuSanA - Forum http://forum.susana.org/ en-gb Recording and additional resources from webinar on Disability- making CLTS fully inclusive - by: Petra http://forum.susana.org/forum/categories/5-clts-community-led-total-sanitation/10928-recording-and-additional-resources-from-webinar-on-disability-making-clts-fully-inclusive#10928 http://forum.susana.org/forum/categories/5-clts-community-led-total-sanitation/10928-recording-and-additional-resources-from-webinar-on-disability-making-clts-fully-inclusive#10928
You can now listen to a recording of the webinar and download the powerpoint presentation here on the CLTS website: www.communityledtotalsanitation.org/reso...ording-and-resources
You will also find a list of resources for further reading on disability, equity and inclusion in WASH.

Get in touch if you have specific questions that follow on from the webinar or post your questions, ideas and views here.

More about the webinar

CLTS aims at total sanitation. For that it has to be inclusive. There are ethical reasons for this, but the bottom line is that while any open defecation continues, all are affected. This webinar will focus on people with disabilities and their particular needs for access to sanitation. People affected tend not to be present at triggering, to lack voice in the community, to have their needs overlooked, and may even be hidden by their families. An initial presentation will outline the reality of the experiences of disabled people, the varied nature of their needs and share examples of how their needs can be met. This will be followed by an open discussion about practical steps that people engaged in CLTS can take to make the different phases and processes of CLTS more inclusive.]]>
CLTS (Community led total sanitation) Tue, 11 Nov 2014 09:16:40 +0000
Re: Debate about effectiveness of CLTS, prompted by UNICEF official after book launch about CLTS in Madagascar - by: joeturner http://forum.susana.org/forum/categories/5-clts-community-led-total-sanitation/10204-debate-about-effectiveness-of-clts-prompted-by-unicef-official-after-book-launch-about-clts-in-madagascar?limit=12&start=24#10847 http://forum.susana.org/forum/categories/5-clts-community-led-total-sanitation/10204-debate-about-effectiveness-of-clts-prompted-by-unicef-official-after-book-launch-about-clts-in-madagascar?limit=12&start=24#10847
It seems to me that this whole process is based on the assumption that people know already a fairly deep amount of information - so that they can deal responsibly with their own sanitation and/or ask relevant questions.]]>
CLTS (Community led total sanitation) Wed, 05 Nov 2014 08:53:04 +0000
Re: Debate about effectiveness of CLTS, prompted by UNICEF official after book launch about CLTS in Madagascar - by: PreethaP http://forum.susana.org/forum/categories/5-clts-community-led-total-sanitation/10204-debate-about-effectiveness-of-clts-prompted-by-unicef-official-after-book-launch-about-clts-in-madagascar?limit=12&start=24#10845 http://forum.susana.org/forum/categories/5-clts-community-led-total-sanitation/10204-debate-about-effectiveness-of-clts-prompted-by-unicef-official-after-book-launch-about-clts-in-madagascar?limit=12&start=24#10845 Yes I agree with you that nothing can be taken for granted and I did not mean to generalise. And of course there are lessons for all of us to learn from different contexts. My point is just that let us also learn from positive examples as much as we need to understand and address the challenges presented by others such as the Tamil Nadu case you mentioned. (I believe that in either of the cases there are many intersecting and influencing factors that contribute to the final outcome and one needs to understand these from various perspectives)

Joe – Please do read my first para in conjunction with the second.

Best reagrds,
preetha]]>
CLTS (Community led total sanitation) Wed, 05 Nov 2014 08:48:33 +0000
Re: Debate about effectiveness of CLTS, prompted by UNICEF official after book launch about CLTS in Madagascar - by: joeturner http://forum.susana.org/forum/categories/5-clts-community-led-total-sanitation/10204-debate-about-effectiveness-of-clts-prompted-by-unicef-official-after-book-launch-about-clts-in-madagascar?limit=12&start=24#10844 http://forum.susana.org/forum/categories/5-clts-community-led-total-sanitation/10204-debate-about-effectiveness-of-clts-prompted-by-unicef-official-after-book-launch-about-clts-in-madagascar?limit=12&start=24#10844 PreethaP wrote:
Hi Joe.

There is an established vast body of knowledge in participatory research and development that have addressed the concerns you raise with your last point. I am sure you would find a lot of your answers in the documented work of experts in this field and Prof. Robert Chamber’s work in this regard (‘Whose reality counts?’, ‘Revolutions in development enquiry’ among others) is especially thought-provoking and inspiring. I believe that rural communities are well plugged into their environment and understand it in deeper ways than what ‘outsiders’ and ‘experts’ may comprehend. And if communities can manage their housing, agriculture, livelihood etc. I am sure they also understand their land, ground water issues etc. well enough to know what solutions work/do not work for them in any particular context. When you get a chance, please also read the book ‘Promising Pathways’ that documents different technological innovations that local people have developed to address their sanitation situation.



Just to be clear here: your position is that local people already have sufficient indigenous soil and groundwater knowledge (never mind engineering, etc) to build sustainable sanitation systems in all contexts that you work in?

If that is what you meant to say, it seems quite a remarkable statement of faith.]]>
CLTS (Community led total sanitation) Wed, 05 Nov 2014 08:32:00 +0000
Re: Debate about effectiveness of CLTS, prompted by UNICEF official after book launch about CLTS in Madagascar - by: DavidAlan http://forum.susana.org/forum/categories/5-clts-community-led-total-sanitation/10204-debate-about-effectiveness-of-clts-prompted-by-unicef-official-after-book-launch-about-clts-in-madagascar?limit=12&start=24#10843 http://forum.susana.org/forum/categories/5-clts-community-led-total-sanitation/10204-debate-about-effectiveness-of-clts-prompted-by-unicef-official-after-book-launch-about-clts-in-madagascar?limit=12&start=24#10843
I believe that rural communities are well plugged into their environment and understand it in deeper ways than what ‘outsiders’ and ‘experts’ may comprehend. And if communities can manage their housing, agriculture, livelihood etc. I am sure they also understand their land, ground water issues etc. well enough to know what solutions work/do not work for them in any particular context.

In my experience they are remarkably, and sadly, lacking in this kind of knowledge. I know of several villages in Tamil Nadu that were encouraged (I do not know if this was part of a CLTS scheme) to construct pit toilets and these have polluted the ground water. This now means that villagers have to buy bottled water with which to drink and cook; they are further stretching a meagre income and there is a real mistrust of sanitation and outsiders.

I don't think we should ever take things for granted at any level of development work, especially relating to sanitation.

David]]>
CLTS (Community led total sanitation) Wed, 05 Nov 2014 08:20:07 +0000
Re: Debate about effectiveness of CLTS, prompted by UNICEF official after book launch about CLTS in Madagascar - by: PreethaP http://forum.susana.org/forum/categories/5-clts-community-led-total-sanitation/10204-debate-about-effectiveness-of-clts-prompted-by-unicef-official-after-book-launch-about-clts-in-madagascar?limit=12&start=24#10840 http://forum.susana.org/forum/categories/5-clts-community-led-total-sanitation/10204-debate-about-effectiveness-of-clts-prompted-by-unicef-official-after-book-launch-about-clts-in-madagascar?limit=12&start=24#10840
There is an established vast body of knowledge in participatory research and development that have addressed the concerns you raise with your last point. I am sure you would find a lot of your answers in the documented work of experts in this field and Prof. Robert Chamber’s work in this regard (‘Whose reality counts?’, ‘Revolutions in development enquiry’ among others) is especially thought-provoking and inspiring. I believe that rural communities are well plugged into their environment and understand it in deeper ways than what ‘outsiders’ and ‘experts’ may comprehend. And if communities can manage their housing, agriculture, livelihood etc. I am sure they also understand their land, ground water issues etc. well enough to know what solutions work/do not work for them in any particular context. When you get a chance, please also read the book ‘Promising Pathways’ that documents different technological innovations that local people have developed to address their sanitation situation.

Having said this, to say that the CLTS process is “community-led” does not mean that the community has to (or does) always work towards a solution in complete isolation. After the triggering event when the community collectively decides to take action, active discussions and explorations are initiated by the community during which time, they often involve the CLTS facilitator/s with whom they share an open and ongoing relationship by then. After the triggering event, there is an intensive period of post-triggering follow-up by the facilitator, when he/she actively engages with the community and together they may discuss issues related to ground water, what type of toilets to construct/buy, sustainability of the same and so on. The CLTS facilitators are mainly government front line staff (such as environmental health and sanitation officers, ministry of rural development, ministry of health officials etc.), community based extension workers, local NGO workers who get trained on CLTS but are also experts in their own respective fields. Many of these facilitators are well entrenched into the community and knowledgeable about their water and sanitation situation. So when the community seeks advice on technological solutions, the facilitators are expected to be equipped with the knowledge and information to offer guidance/choices or else be able to connect the community to other people/experts/sources who can offer the required guidance that the community seeks.

The key outcome that CLTS strives for is igniting collective behaviour change such that the entire community feels the need to stop open defecation immediately and takes collective action to achieve it. However, at what stage of the sanitation ladder one gets on to and how soon one moves up that ladder will depend on individual psycho-social and economic drivers and other aspects of accessibility, availability etc. This is why, once ODF is attained, the final stage of the CLTS process – post ODF activities - becomes very important and critical, not only in sustaining the achieved ODF behaviour change but also in enabling communities to move up the ladder. We all need to work towards addressing these challenges by connecting the state, market and the community together strategically.

I believe these thoughts might also answer a few other questions/comments posted earlier on this thread. Hoping to respond to some others at a later time.

Best regards,
preetha]]>
CLTS (Community led total sanitation) Wed, 05 Nov 2014 08:11:36 +0000
Re: Debate about effectiveness of CLTS, prompted by UNICEF official after book launch about CLTS in Madagascar - by: Petra http://forum.susana.org/forum/categories/5-clts-community-led-total-sanitation/10204-debate-about-effectiveness-of-clts-prompted-by-unicef-official-after-book-launch-about-clts-in-madagascar?limit=12&start=24#10803 http://forum.susana.org/forum/categories/5-clts-community-led-total-sanitation/10204-debate-about-effectiveness-of-clts-prompted-by-unicef-official-after-book-launch-about-clts-in-madagascar?limit=12&start=24#10803 Earlier this year, the CLTS Knowledge Hub launched its new logo to prevent his confusion.]]> CLTS (Community led total sanitation) Mon, 03 Nov 2014 11:01:49 +0000 Re: Debate about effectiveness of CLTS, prompted by UNICEF official after book launch about CLTS in Madagascar - by: joeturner http://forum.susana.org/forum/categories/5-clts-community-led-total-sanitation/10204-debate-about-effectiveness-of-clts-prompted-by-unicef-official-after-book-launch-about-clts-in-madagascar?limit=12&start=24#10801 http://forum.susana.org/forum/categories/5-clts-community-led-total-sanitation/10204-debate-about-effectiveness-of-clts-prompted-by-unicef-official-after-book-launch-about-clts-in-madagascar?limit=12&start=24#10801
PreethaP wrote:



In effect, the point is that CLTS is not oblivious to or anti the technology question. It is just not the question that has to be brought up at all when the initial discussion takes place in the community. Because bringing it up as an issue upfront means that the entire objective of making sanitation a felt community need is defeated. Also, any discussion on toilets and technology before igniting collective behaviour change among the community means that the sanitation question is being framed in advance by the outside facilitation and is therefore, an external concern and not internal to the community which has never felt it to be an issue of consequence anyway. CLTS has shown that the objective of making sanitation an internal concern – felt and owned by the community - can be met only by enabling the community to engage in self-analysis, realize their own situation and behaviour; understand consequences and resolve to take collective action at its own level. Safe confinement is a matter that the community is likely to bring up on its own during this process and toilet choices will be made from a range of options depending on legacy, stage of understanding, available material and capacity, affordability, sustainability, personal and community preference. Facilitators are expected to be able to assist in this process with information on choices, their advantages, disadvantages and costs. So here the technology aspect does come in very clearly. The point is that this technology question (or intervention) needs to be brought into the process at the right moment – after collective behaviour change of the community has been ignited and community demand for sanitation solutions has been created – and that the facilitator should not push for a particular mode when there are various options/modes that confine excreta safely in that particular context.


OK but how do you decide when the right moment is to tell a community that the technology that they could think, and build on their own is not going to last very long?

Do the facilitators know about the groundwater problems? Are you saying that they do not bring up any potential issues unless local people ask them? How, actually, can illiterate villagers be expected to know enough about hydrology to ask the right questions? I don't understand.]]>
CLTS (Community led total sanitation) Mon, 03 Nov 2014 10:59:18 +0000
Re: Debate about effectiveness of CLTS, prompted by UNICEF official after book launch about CLTS in Madagascar - by: joeturner http://forum.susana.org/forum/categories/5-clts-community-led-total-sanitation/10204-debate-about-effectiveness-of-clts-prompted-by-unicef-official-after-book-launch-about-clts-in-madagascar?limit=12&start=24#10800 http://forum.susana.org/forum/categories/5-clts-community-led-total-sanitation/10204-debate-about-effectiveness-of-clts-prompted-by-unicef-official-after-book-launch-about-clts-in-madagascar?limit=12&start=24#10800 CLTS (Community led total sanitation) Mon, 03 Nov 2014 10:52:26 +0000 Re: Debate about effectiveness of CLTS, prompted by UNICEF official after book launch about CLTS in Madagascar - by: Petra http://forum.susana.org/forum/categories/5-clts-community-led-total-sanitation/10204-debate-about-effectiveness-of-clts-prompted-by-unicef-official-after-book-launch-about-clts-in-madagascar?limit=12&start=24#10799 http://forum.susana.org/forum/categories/5-clts-community-led-total-sanitation/10204-debate-about-effectiveness-of-clts-prompted-by-unicef-official-after-book-launch-about-clts-in-madagascar?limit=12&start=24#10799
IDS is a big organisation and the CLTS Knowledge Hub is one project amongst many. So the IDS website does not represent the Hub and the Hub's website www.communityledtotalsanitation.org does not represent the work or views of IDS as a whole.]]>
CLTS (Community led total sanitation) Mon, 03 Nov 2014 10:49:03 +0000
Re: Debate about effectiveness of CLTS, prompted by UNICEF official after book launch about CLTS in Madagascar - by: joeturner http://forum.susana.org/forum/categories/5-clts-community-led-total-sanitation/10204-debate-about-effectiveness-of-clts-prompted-by-unicef-official-after-book-launch-about-clts-in-madagascar?limit=12&start=24#10798 http://forum.susana.org/forum/categories/5-clts-community-led-total-sanitation/10204-debate-about-effectiveness-of-clts-prompted-by-unicef-official-after-book-launch-about-clts-in-madagascar?limit=12&start=24#10798
knotsids.blogspot.co.uk/2014/07/the-road...experiences-and.html]]>
CLTS (Community led total sanitation) Mon, 03 Nov 2014 10:44:00 +0000
Re: Debate about effectiveness of CLTS, prompted by UNICEF official after book launch about CLTS in Madagascar - by: joeturner http://forum.susana.org/forum/categories/5-clts-community-led-total-sanitation/10204-debate-about-effectiveness-of-clts-prompted-by-unicef-official-after-book-launch-about-clts-in-madagascar?limit=12&start=24#10797 http://forum.susana.org/forum/categories/5-clts-community-led-total-sanitation/10204-debate-about-effectiveness-of-clts-prompted-by-unicef-official-after-book-launch-about-clts-in-madagascar?limit=12&start=24#10797
www.communityledtotalsanitation.org/page/kamal-kar]]>
CLTS (Community led total sanitation) Mon, 03 Nov 2014 10:39:10 +0000
Re: Debate about effectiveness of CLTS, prompted by UNICEF official after book launch about CLTS in Madagascar - by: Petra http://forum.susana.org/forum/categories/5-clts-community-led-total-sanitation/10204-debate-about-effectiveness-of-clts-prompted-by-unicef-official-after-book-launch-about-clts-in-madagascar?limit=12&start=24#10796 http://forum.susana.org/forum/categories/5-clts-community-led-total-sanitation/10204-debate-about-effectiveness-of-clts-prompted-by-unicef-official-after-book-launch-about-clts-in-madagascar?limit=12&start=24#10796 CLTS (Community led total sanitation) Mon, 03 Nov 2014 10:34:10 +0000 Re: Debate about effectiveness of CLTS, prompted by UNICEF official after book launch about CLTS in Madagascar - by: Petra http://forum.susana.org/forum/categories/5-clts-community-led-total-sanitation/10204-debate-about-effectiveness-of-clts-prompted-by-unicef-official-after-book-launch-about-clts-in-madagascar?limit=12&start=24#10795 http://forum.susana.org/forum/categories/5-clts-community-led-total-sanitation/10204-debate-about-effectiveness-of-clts-prompted-by-unicef-official-after-book-launch-about-clts-in-madagascar?limit=12&start=24#10795
I was indeed just wanting to clarify that the CLTS Foundation and Kamal are not synonymous with the CLTS Knowledge Hub at IDS. No further inbetween the lines meaning! And whilst both organisations work on CLTS, we do so in quite different ways and often with different views and opinions.
To further clarify, the methodology was created by Kamal Kar with WaterAid in Bangladesh. Robert and IDS only became involved afterwards.

No hair-splitting, just pointing out that the CLTS Knowledge Hub does not necessarily endorse what the CLTSF does and vice versa.We were not involved in the production or publication of the book on Madagascar and only found out about it just before it was being launched.

And Joe, no KK does not regularly contribute to the CLTS Blog or the website. There is actually not a single blog by KK on the CLTS website.

We have also seen the correspondence between UNICEF and various representatives of the Malagassy government. And in keeping with the requests made by UNICEF in this conversation and since without actually going to Madagascar and doing research it is difficult to say what is really happening on the ground, I cannot comment on what figures are correct. As anyone involved in WASH and or CLTS in any country knows is that getting reliable data is a challenge. There are many cases of over-reporting, data massaging to meet (often highly unrealistic) targets. Monitoring, verification and follow up are key issues for sustainability and most countries are still grappling with putting adequate systems in place. There is much to learn and much need for innovation. And an even bigger need for honest sharing of what is happening, ongoing reflection including admission of failures and creative thinking and collaboration on ways forward. Happy to engage in discussion of what might work, but like Elisabeth , I don't really like engaging in lengthy debates that are driven by blame, personal attack and which, in my opinion, especially in virtual fora like this one, do not go anywhere and take up a lot of valuable time.]]>
CLTS (Community led total sanitation) Mon, 03 Nov 2014 10:31:49 +0000
Re: Debate about effectiveness of CLTS, prompted by UNICEF official after book launch about CLTS in Madagascar - by: F H Mughal http://forum.susana.org/forum/categories/5-clts-community-led-total-sanitation/10204-debate-about-effectiveness-of-clts-prompted-by-unicef-official-after-book-launch-about-clts-in-madagascar?limit=12&start=24#10794 http://forum.susana.org/forum/categories/5-clts-community-led-total-sanitation/10204-debate-about-effectiveness-of-clts-prompted-by-unicef-official-after-book-launch-about-clts-in-madagascar?limit=12&start=24#10794
David: Could you kindly post the UNICEF's official email, you are referring to? - Thanks

F H Mughal]]>
CLTS (Community led total sanitation) Mon, 03 Nov 2014 10:23:25 +0000