SuSanA - Forum Kunena Site Syndication http://forum.susana.org/ Sun, 26 Mar 2017 20:45:59 +0000 Kunena 1.6 http://forum.susana.org/components/com_kunena/template/default/images/icons/rss.png SuSanA - Forum http://forum.susana.org/ en-gb Re: Wikipedia translation tool - what's better, translate the entire article or the leads only? Does it get overwritten? - by: muench http://forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wikipedia/20952-wikipedia-translation-tool-whats-better-translate-the-entire-article-or-the-leads-only-does-it-get-overwritten#20985 http://forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wikipedia/20952-wikipedia-translation-tool-whats-better-translate-the-entire-article-or-the-leads-only-does-it-get-overwritten#20985
Thanks for your reply and it was so great to "e-meet" you in the virtual workroom durnig the edit-a-thon on Monday and Tuesday!

Just to clarify on Dorian's question: if I understood right he's saying that the translator tool only works on the entire article but doesn't let you translate section by section (with that tool). Is that correct?
Or have you found a way of using the translator tool in a different way?

About letting others know about translations in progress: I think that is a very good idea. I would suggest you put that kind of note on the talk page of the English article and also on the talk page of the other-language article (if it exists already). People planning to translate a page should then first check on the talk page.

In addition, we can also use this Forum category on Wikipedia for this purpose. Furthermore, I am thinking of perhaps creating a mailing list for Wikipedia SuSanA enthousiasts which could then also help for this purpose (I am yet to run this idea by the secretariat). What do you think about this idea?

Regards,
Elisabeth]]>
Wikipedia Wed, 22 Mar 2017 13:37:16 +0000
Re: [In French] C'est parti ! Prioritized list of French articles to edit ! Edit-a-thon (19th-21th of March) - by: DorianD http://forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wikipedia/20861-in-french-cest-parti--prioritized-list-of-french-articles-to-edit--edit-a-thon-19th-21th-of-march#20983 http://forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wikipedia/20861-in-french-cest-parti--prioritized-list-of-french-articles-to-edit--edit-a-thon-19th-21th-of-march#20983 This post is published in both English and French languages.
Hello everyone,
As a result of the edit-a-thon event two articles of the list above were translated from the English version :
//
Bonjour à tous,
A la suite de du marathon d'édition, deux articles ont été créés sur le wikipedia francophone:

Behavior change
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Behavior_change_(public_health)
//
Changement de comportement
https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Changement_de_comportement

and
Open defecation
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_defecation
//
Défécation en plein air
https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/D%C3%A9f%C3%A9cation_en_plein_air

The Cranfield team will continue to translate several articles of the top-list during the next few weeks.
Let's continue to share knowledge in french to improve life of millions of people living in francophone countries without access to toilet!
//
L'équipe va continuer à traduire plusieurs articles durant les prochaines semaines.
Continuons ensemble à partager la connaisance en francais pour améliorer la vie des millions de personnes qui vivent en pays francophone et qui n'ont pas accés à des toilettes !

The Cranfield team]]>
Wikipedia Wed, 22 Mar 2017 11:10:31 +0000
Re: Wikipedia translation tool - what's better, translate the entire article or the leads only? Does it get overwritten? - by: canaday http://forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wikipedia/20952-wikipedia-translation-tool-whats-better-translate-the-entire-article-or-the-leads-only-does-it-get-overwritten#20982 http://forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wikipedia/20952-wikipedia-translation-tool-whats-better-translate-the-entire-article-or-the-leads-only-does-it-get-overwritten#20982
I would say that all of the above are fine, depending on each person's time and interest. Remember that Wikipedia is put together by human beings and not robots. Everyone brings to the task their own interests, knowledge, experience, photos, and sensibilities. If we look at the versions of various pages in the different languages, they are almost never exact copies of one another.

I do like the idea of somehow announcing that someone is doing a certain translation, to avoid duplicating efforts. We could do this here on the forum, on that other page that was created for the Edit-a-thon, AND/OR by simply uploading immediately the intro on to Wikipedia with a little note at the end, something like "(I am continuing to translate this page and, if anyone else wants to help, we can divide up the sections.)"

Best wishes,
Chris Canaday]]>
Wikipedia Wed, 22 Mar 2017 10:49:02 +0000
Re: Wikipedia translation tool - what's better, translate the entire article or the leads only? Does it get overwritten? - by: JulyG http://forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wikipedia/20952-wikipedia-translation-tool-whats-better-translate-the-entire-article-or-the-leads-only-does-it-get-overwritten#20958 http://forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wikipedia/20952-wikipedia-translation-tool-whats-better-translate-the-entire-article-or-the-leads-only-does-it-get-overwritten#20958
I would say the first strategy is better to provide a well-detailed article in the first place and let other editors focus on adding information or edit language later on.
We have discussed both strategies with Elisabeth and we agreed that it should be working better with strategy 1.
Otherwise, we should communicate on which articles we are working, to avoid being two people working at the same time on the same article.

I have used strategy 1 to translate in French the Behaviour Change article fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Changement_de_comportement It worked quite well!

Kind regards,
July]]>
Wikipedia Mon, 20 Mar 2017 21:03:10 +0000
Wikipedia translation tool - what's better, translate the entire article or the leads only? Does it get overwritten? - by: DorianD http://forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wikipedia/20952-wikipedia-translation-tool-whats-better-translate-the-entire-article-or-the-leads-only-does-it-get-overwritten#20952 http://forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wikipedia/20952-wikipedia-translation-tool-whats-better-translate-the-entire-article-or-the-leads-only-does-it-get-overwritten#20952 I'm currently translating some articles from English to french as part of the edit-a-thon event.
I'm hesitating between two strategies:
1st: Create a new french article as detailed as possible from the English version. ( even if it's a really long article ?)
2nd: Start to translate the LEAD part for all of the key articles of the list presented by julyG (link below) then make the rest after.
http://forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wikipedia-and-other-wikis/20861-in-french-cest-parti--prioritized-list-of-french-articles-to-edit--edit-a

I think the 1st way is better because it will allow us to quickly provide a basis of content for further editing.
But, I'm wondering about the consequences if for example, I go back to an articles that I have already partially translated a few days before. Is it going to overwrite all the contributions done by others between my two editing?
In others words, is it possible to use the translating tool to translate section instead of a full article?

If not and if the only way to translate a full article with the tool is to do it entirely before to post, should we follow the 1st strategy ?

Dorian]]>
Wikipedia Mon, 20 Mar 2017 14:57:04 +0000
Re: WG 7: Take part in SuSanA's Wikipedia Edit-a-thon for World Water Day (19th/20th March)! - by: joeturner http://forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wikipedia/20940-be-aware-of-using-reliable-sources-and-link-to-website-rather-than-to-the-pdf-file-directly#20949 http://forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wikipedia/20940-be-aware-of-using-reliable-sources-and-link-to-website-rather-than-to-the-pdf-file-directly#20949 Wikipedia Mon, 20 Mar 2017 13:05:42 +0000 Re: WG 7: Take part in SuSanA's Wikipedia Edit-a-thon for World Water Day (19th/20th March)! - by: muench http://forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wikipedia/20940-be-aware-of-using-reliable-sources-and-link-to-website-rather-than-to-the-pdf-file-directly#20948 http://forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wikipedia/20940-be-aware-of-using-reliable-sources-and-link-to-website-rather-than-to-the-pdf-file-directly#20948 en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peak_phosphorus

I agree with Joe that it's usually better to provide a link to the website where the pdf file is located, rather than linking to the pdf file directly. The same applies to documents in the SuSanA library: rather link to the HTML page where the document is, rather than directly to the pdf file.

If there is a pdf file that is not yet on the internet, we can also upload it to the SuSanA library to give it a URL.

Another observation I have about the peak phosphorus article is that the lead (the first 4 paragraphs before the table of conent) does not seem to be a good summary of the article? Could you perhaps improve that, Arno?

Regards,
Elisabeth]]>
Wikipedia Mon, 20 Mar 2017 12:48:45 +0000
Re: WG 7: Take part in SuSanA's Wikipedia Edit-a-thon for World Water Day (19th/20th March)! - by: arno http://forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wikipedia/20940-be-aware-of-using-reliable-sources-and-link-to-website-rather-than-to-the-pdf-file-directly#20947 http://forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wikipedia/20940-be-aware-of-using-reliable-sources-and-link-to-website-rather-than-to-the-pdf-file-directly#20947 The wikipedia page on peak phosphorus was updated with the all important data on commercial reserves published officially by USGS. minerals.usgs.gov/minerals/pubs/commodity/phosphate_rock/
Yes it's a PDF that is the source. The wikipedia page had data from 2009. There is no official source that is more authoritative than USGS. There is no UN body that monitors rock phosphate. There are no updated data published on a regular basis by industry either.

One can see that things have changed radically in that the US reserves rate now as 10th. They used to be third.

Regards
--Arno]]>
Wikipedia Mon, 20 Mar 2017 12:19:25 +0000
Re: Who invented the term "WASH" for water, sanitation, hygiene? - And: Watsan or WASH for the French Wikipedia article? - by: JulyG http://forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wikipedia/16379-who-invented-the-term-qwashq-for-water-sanitation-hygiene-and-watsan-or-wash-for-the-french-wikipedia-article#20942 http://forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wikipedia/16379-who-invented-the-term-qwashq-for-water-sanitation-hygiene-and-watsan-or-wash-for-the-french-wikipedia-article#20942
Thank you for the clarifications about WASH/Watsan/EAH.
I will merge both WASH and Watsan pages into one and speak about EAH.

Kind regards,
July]]>
Wikipedia Mon, 20 Mar 2017 09:03:27 +0000
Be aware of using reliable sources - and link to website rather than to the pdf file directly - by: joeturner http://forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wikipedia/20940-be-aware-of-using-reliable-sources-and-link-to-website-rather-than-to-the-pdf-file-directly#20940 http://forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wikipedia/20940-be-aware-of-using-reliable-sources-and-link-to-website-rather-than-to-the-pdf-file-directly#20940
First, please be aware of your sources. The pages that we (ie WikiProject Sanitation) work on are obviously not as well-used as many others on wikipedia - however there is a wikipedia-wide effort to improve the quality of sources used to cite information. In general, we should be looking to cite almost every fact we can with a published and peer-reviewed source. Of course, that's not always possible, but we do need to be careful not to just link to a pdf we've found online of something. For example, someone has linked to a pdf from the US Geological Survey for numbers on en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peak_phosphorus

I have left it (for now), but I'm not sure it is really what we'd call a "reliable source", because it isn't an official document released by the USGS and so we can't be sure it is preliminary or contains mistakes. A published paper (or official USGS document) may well be older but... well, if it is wrong we can blame someone else. Whereas if we've just accidentally found something that was never intended to be released to the public and contains errors, we're spreading misinformation. There is a whole, horrible discussion on reliable sources on wikipedia if anyone is interested (see en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Identifying_reliable_sources) but my summary is as above. If you use inferior sources, the chances are that your work will be removed at some point, so it is better to take more time to use better ones.

Second, I'm not sure that pages like en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Co-composting will survive. The reason is that "new pages" are aggressively monitored and are often removed if they're not shown to have enough to say outwith of any other page. It isn't usually a great idea to start a one-line page, I'd prefer you wrote a section on another page and then when that got too big expanded it onto another.

This might not be a problem with this particular page if you're planning to come back soon and write a lot more. But possibly something to be aware of.]]>
Wikipedia Mon, 20 Mar 2017 08:48:43 +0000
Re: Who invented the term "WASH" for water, sanitation, hygiene? - And: Watsan or WASH for the French Wikipedia article? - by: muench http://forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wikipedia/16379-who-invented-the-term-qwashq-for-water-sanitation-hygiene-and-watsan-or-wash-for-the-french-wikipedia-article#20937 http://forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wikipedia/16379-who-invented-the-term-qwashq-for-water-sanitation-hygiene-and-watsan-or-wash-for-the-french-wikipedia-article#20937 You said:
Since you are doing research on this, you may try to find out whether it should be WASH or WaSH.

It is nowadays more often WASH than WaSH. That's also what Wikipedia says so it must be true!
See here:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WASH

The main spelling is given as WASH. Alternative spellings are Watsan or WaSH.

Want to know more about Wikipedia and who edits it and how?
Come to the virtual work room which is open right now and until Tuesday 21 March at noon GMT!
Just come here: seint.adobeconnect.com/wpeditathon/ (no password required, simply enter as guest with your name)

Regards,
Elisabeth]]>
Wikipedia Sun, 19 Mar 2017 20:54:33 +0000
Re: Who invented the term "WASH" for water, sanitation, hygiene? - And: Watsan or WASH for the French Wikipedia article? - by: cecile http://forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wikipedia/16379-who-invented-the-term-qwashq-for-water-sanitation-hygiene-and-watsan-or-wash-for-the-french-wikipedia-article#20935 http://forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wikipedia/16379-who-invented-the-term-qwashq-for-water-sanitation-hygiene-and-watsan-or-wash-for-the-french-wikipedia-article#20935 Sur le terrain c'est différent, par le passé on employait toujours Watsan mais il me semble que maitenant c'est de plus en plus WASH.
Bien à vous,
Cécile]]>
Wikipedia Sun, 19 Mar 2017 17:14:25 +0000
Re: Who invented the term "WASH" for water, sanitation, hygiene? - And: Watsan or WASH for the French Wikipedia article? - by: F H Mughal http://forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wikipedia/16379-who-invented-the-term-qwashq-for-water-sanitation-hygiene-and-watsan-or-wash-for-the-french-wikipedia-article#20929 http://forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wikipedia/16379-who-invented-the-term-qwashq-for-water-sanitation-hygiene-and-watsan-or-wash-for-the-french-wikipedia-article#20929
Many times, I have seen WASH written as WaSH, since "a" in this is the second letter of Water.
I, quite often, gets mixed up - whether I should go for WASH or WaSH.

Since you are doing research on this, you may try to find out whether it should be WASH or WaSH.

Regards,

F H Mughal]]>
Wikipedia Sun, 19 Mar 2017 04:51:14 +0000
Re: SuSanA Wikipedia Edit-a-thon - Virtual Workroom is open to all this Sunday for 48 hours (starting noon GMT) - by: muench http://forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wikipedia/20804-six-tips-for-susana-members-starting-out-on-wikipedia-things-to-look-out-for#20927 http://forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wikipedia/20804-six-tips-for-susana-members-starting-out-on-wikipedia-things-to-look-out-for#20927
Please don't get disheartened about the vandalism aspect on Wikipedia. James once wrote this on the forum which left a lasting impression on me:*

10) "Non-credible pages" It is about the references. Wikipedia is only as good as the references it is built upon. Most people are good people. If one does not believe this then yes their is no reason to contribute to Wikipedia (or to any other social cause really).


There is also a policy in Wikipedia that is called "Assume good faith"
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Assume_good_faith

I copy from that article:

Assuming good faith (AGF) is a fundamental principle on Wikipedia. It is the assumption that editors' edits and comments are made in good faith. Most people try to help the project, not hurt it. If this were untrue, a project like Wikipedia would be doomed from the beginning. This guideline does not require that editors continue to assume good faith in the presence of obvious evidence to the contrary (e.g. vandalism). Assuming good faith does not prohibit discussion and criticism. Rather, editors should not attribute the actions being criticized to malice unless there is specific evidence of such.


So, let's stay positive and have trust in mankind.

Regards,
Elisabeth

* This thread on the Forum started in October 2014 which is when my Wikipedia journal began thanks to the encouragement of James Heilman. James and colleagues are working on bringing all medical content up to scratch on Wikipedia with their WikiProject Medicine.
forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wi...2&start=12#10463
Go to page 2 of the thread on 10 Oct 2014 in case the link doesn't go to the right place which sometimes happens.]]>
Wikipedia Sun, 19 Mar 2017 00:51:21 +0000
SuSanA Wikipedia Edit-a-thon - Virtual Workroom is open to all this Sunday for 48 hours (starting noon GMT) - by: muench http://forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wikipedia/20804-six-tips-for-susana-members-starting-out-on-wikipedia-things-to-look-out-for#20925 http://forum.susana.org/component/kunena/198-wikipedia/20804-six-tips-for-susana-members-starting-out-on-wikipedia-things-to-look-out-for#20925 Tip of the Day Number 6: Be prepared to undo vandalism and spot incorrect information

Undoing vandalism:

Do you get pissed off with vandalism in your neighborhood? Like when drunk people destroy a new bus stop, spray graffiti where it doesn't belong or litter in the park? Well, sadly, vandalism also exists in Wikipedia. Luckily it is not that prevalent you can do your part to spot vandalism and undo it. This can be done in two clicks:
  1. Put articles that you care about on your watchlist.
  2. Whenever there is a change to that article you will receive an e-mail from Wikipedia (or you can check it on your watchlist)
  3. If it's clear vandalism, then all you have to do is to click the button called "undo" (if needed you can also "restore" an earlier version of the article). Common vandalism edits are somebody adding a sentence like "Peter is an asshole" or "this is sick" or just deleting paragraphs for no reason and without an explanation)


If you want to take further steps you can also:
  1. Write on that person's talk page (there are automated messages that you can use), although vandals usually use IP addresses, no real Wikipedia logins, so they come and go very quickly.
  2. Ensure that this person is blocked if it's a repeated vandalism case. Sadly the vandal could come back with another Wikipedia account on another IP address though.

Another thing that can be done is to "protect" or "semi-protect" a Wikipedia article. I have requested this for some articles that attracted repeated vandalism, like the ones on urine, feces, toilet, menstruation. An article that is locked has a little lock symbol at the top right and can only be edited by auto-confirmed users (it is quite easy to get to that status; I got it quite fast). If you want to know how to propose an article for protection, see here: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Protecti...licy#Semi-protection

This is what the lock looks like, see at the top right of the article. If you go to an article like this, and you are a novice user (i.e. not yet auto-confirmed), then you won't be able to use the edit buttons for this article, or they may not even be visible:




See e.g. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toilet


Spotting incorrect information

Another form of vandalism that is harder to spot is when people change information in a kind of subtle way. E.g. they change a number from 100 to 1000. or 2.6 billion to 2.8 billion. Here you have to ask yourself "are they providing a reliable reference to justify this change?". If not, what is this editor up to, does he or seem to be reliable? For that, you can check that person's user page on Wikipedia, their talk page and their contributions to date. You can check any user's contributions to the left of their user page. E.g. my contributions look like this:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/EMsmile

By checking out that information about the editor in question you can normally quite quickly assess if this is someone doing good work on Wikipedia or if this is a Wikipedian who has caused trouble. This is also the reason why I recommend to put some basic information on your own user page (but no need to reveal any personal information or who you work for or what you have published etc; keep a bit of anonymity, I would say, and don't try to stress that you are "the expert" on a topic - but this is something I will put into one of the next tips of the day!).

Happy Wikipedia editing and reading!

Kind regards,
Elisabeth]]>
Wikipedia Sat, 18 Mar 2017 19:43:13 +0000